Aa history Lovers 2010 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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I never led meetings (neither did Dr. Bob) or talked into a microphone. Nobody led our meetings in the very early days. We all just sat around in a circle. After the opening prayer and a short text from the Bible, we had quiet time, silently praying for guidance about what to say. Then each person in turn said something, asking for any help he wanted, bringing up anything that was troubling him or just whatever was on his mind. After everyone was through, there were announcements and we held hands and said the Lord's Prayer .... For the first five years we met in someone's home every night .... In that first group, Dr. Bob selected the readings and made all the appointments and all the major decisions. (I was the first secretary of the group and the following year became chairman.) Everyone had to make a complete surrender to join in the first place, and so we had no reservations; we worked the whole program, 100 percent .... We did not tell our drinking histories at the meetings back then. We did not need to. A man's sponsor and Dr. Bob knew the details. Frankly, we did not think it was anybody else's business. We were anonymous and so was our life. Besides, we already knew how to drink. What we wanted to learn was how to get sober and stay sober. Bill Wilson was in favor of having at least fifty percent of an AA member's talk at a meeting consist of "qualifying" or telling the story of how he became an alcoholic. Bill himself had a warm, friendly disposition, and this idea of his did attract people and enable the movement to grow to a size where it had helped thousands of people all over the world. For that we must be grateful.
began, it took some getting used to on our part. I remember one time when we were meeting at King School; some people came in from Cleveland, and most of the qualifying they did was really very bad. They clapped and made a lot of noise. To us it seemed strange and offensive. Gradually we opened up under Bill's persuasive influence. But we still did not care for it when people would get carried away by their own voice and make their stories too sensational and repulsive. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6263. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Early meeting format: were they all speaker meetings? From: James Blair . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/20/2010 2:40:00 PM
(jblair at videotron.ca) I can only speak for Quebec. All AA meetings up to the early sixties were closed meetings but we did have open meetings which were in fact public meetings.
services, medicine, courts and AA. They were held in a large hall on the first Sunday night of each month and they would draw from 75 to 300 persons. They were well advertised on radio and in newspapers. Representatives of different agencies would speak about the impact of alcoholism on families and individuals. The AA speaker would go last.
stating "my name is Joe B. and I'm an alcoholic" got started in our province. At the closed meetings people did not do that. Jim - - - - From: bevflk@aol.com (bevflk at aol.com) I go to a meeting in Tucson, Arizona. Matt l. has 58 years of sobriety. He was one of the fortunate to be helped by Dr. Silkworth for his alcoholism. He told his story at Founders Day here and stated that all of the first meetings were speaker meetings. He also said that men back then wore suits, shirts and ties. He still dresses up to this day.
(blhump272 at sctv.coop) From 1975 on my experience has been the same as now. Not all speaker meetings. I am like you, in talking to old timers from 1940 on they were not all speaker meetings but open and closed meetings and speaker meetings were on the agenda. Ben H. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6264. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Swedenborgianism and the Burnham family''s religious beliefs From: Hugh D. Hyatt . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/22/2010 3:50:00 PM
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/AAHistoryLovers/message/6199 "In reading this post and a couple of others I decided to do some reading tonite on the Swedenborgian religion and their movment ....
phrase "twelve steps:" > They [angels with whom Swedenborg spoke] picture wisdom, they said, > as a wonderfully elegant palace with twelve steps leading up to it. > No one gets to the first step except with the Lord's help and by > union with him, and for all of us, the ascent depends on that union. > The higher we climb, the more clearly we realize that no one is wise > on her or his own, but only from the Lord. We also realize that > relative to what we do not know, what we do know is like a droplet > compared to a vast lake. The twelve steps to the palace of wisdom > mean whatever is good united to what is true and whatever is true > united to what is good. This is from his book /Divine Providence/, paragraph #36. As a lifelong Swedenborgian and recovering alcoholic myself, I would say that the closest thing that Swedenborg has to A.A.'s twelve steps are the four steps of repentance described in paragraph #530 of his work /True Christian Religion./ After explaining the necessity of repentance, Swedenborg says:
> the reply is, Actually; that is to say, he must examine himself, > recognize and acknowledge his sins, pray to the Lord, and begin a > new life. A number of years ago, I corresponded with a Swedenborgian minister who had interviewed Lois Wilson. He asked specifically about the influence of Swedenborgianism on A.A. and Al-Anon. As I recall, her response was completely non-committal, saying that even if some particular religion /had/ had significant influence, she couldn't very well say so, could she?
Hugh H.
Willow Grove, PA The love of one's country is a splendid thing. But why should love stop at the border. -- Pablo Casals
From: J. Lobdell . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/22/2010 3:52:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII He was born in Akron June 19 1904 and died there in February 1977. The Silkworth site gives the following material and references on him: "Bob E. - wealthy banker, joined A.A. February 1937, made AA address books, member Akron's wealthiest families [C 132] [D 101, 116-19, 122-23, 142, 146, 152, 156-57, 176, 217, 221-23] [N 53]"
Amos shows him with 16 months sobriety at a time when Dr. Bob had 33 and Bill D. had 32, thus in March 1938. This would put Bob E's sobriety to November 1936, before he "came in" in February 1937. His father William H. E. was President of the Bank.
From Glenn C. (South Bend, Indiana): The list of the First 226 Members of the Akron, Ohio AA Group http://hindsfoot.org/akrn226.doc
which seems to mean that he was counted as one of the first 27 members.
Ohio. In those days in Akron, would that have been a fancy address, the sort of place a wealthy banker would live? That would be one way of checking to see whether that claim was true. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6266. . . . . . . . . . . . The Big Book in the rain barrel From: James Bliss . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/22/2010 6:30:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I was reminded of a story which I have heard in AA about someone in Alaska who found a Big Book in the bottom of a rain barrel and got sober reading it. Is there any historical fact behind this story? Thanks, Jim IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6267. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Henry (Hank) P. From: Jay Pees . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/21/2010 3:55:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII And his funeral is listed as January 22. On Wed, Jan 20, 2010 at 2:52 PM, jax760 > Hi Chuck, > > The information you require can by found in the > New Jersey Herald, January 27, 1954. Although > I do not have a copy I believe it lists the date > as January 18th. > > Regards > > > "Chuck Parkhurst" > > > > I am looking for a confirmation with source > > reference, for the date of death for Henry > > "Hank" Parkhurst. I have seen his death > > reported as 1/18 and 1/21, each time in the > > year 1954. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6268. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: The Big Book in the rain barrel From: Edward . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/23/2010 6:03:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII This story is quoted in _As Bill Sees It_ p. 245 - the reference given is to _AA Comes Of Age_ pp. 82-83 ...
Ted G.
Also from From: Jay Pees - - - - In AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com, James Bliss > > I was reminded of a story which I have heard > in AA about someone in Alaska who found a > Big Book in the bottom of a rain barrel and > got sober reading it. > > Is there any historical fact behind this story? > > Thanks, > > Jim
> IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6269. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: How quickly should the twelve steps be taken? From: Bill Lash . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/23/2010 1:45:00 PM
about this. I feel this is an important point for all of us so I just want to make clear what I see being said here so that there is no misunderstanding. What it says on page 98 & 99 of Ernie's wonderful book "Not God" is as follows:
the loving presence of such a receptive listener. Then, Bill had unburdened himself especially to Ebby. But it was only now, as this evening with Father Dowling wore on, that the man who had written A.A.'s Fifth Step came to feel that he himself was finally "taking his Fifth." He told Dowling not only what he had done and had left undone - he went on to share with his new sponsor the thoughts and feelings behind those actions and omissions."
seemed wise, for I showed signs of delirium tremens. "There I humbly offered myself to God, as I then I understood Him, to do with me as He would. I placed myself unreservedly under His care and direction. I admitted for the first time that of myself I was nothing; that without Him I was lost. I ruthlessly faced my sins and became willing to have my new-found Friend take them away, root and branch. I have not had a drink since. "My schoolmate visited me, and I fully acquainted him with my problems and deficiencies." Ernie is stating above in his own book that Bill did his FIRST 5th Step when he first got sober ("Not since his earliest days in the Oxford Group...Bill had unburdened himself especially to Ebby" & then in the Big Book while Bill was still in Towns Hospital "I fully acquainted him with my problems and deficiencies", both of these descriptions are of the Oxford Group's version of a 5th Step), and then Bill did ANOTHER 5th Step with Fr. Dowling. The only way you can say that Bill's sharing with Fr. Dowling was Bill's "first" 5th Step was because when Bill shared with Ebby when he got sober in 1938 there were no 12 Steps yet, so in 1938 they wouldn't have called it a 5th Step. Nevertheless, using today's AA language, Bill DID do his FIRST 5th Step when he first got sober, NOT only after finally meeting Fr. Dowling.
Dowling that: "Bill felt for the first time completely cleansed and freed". Bill ALSO describes in the Big Book how he felt from his original 5th Step with Ebby (along with the other Oxford Group work that he did, which later became the 12 Steps) that: "...the effect was electric. There was a sense of victory, followed by such a peace and serenity as I had never known. There was utter confidence. I felt lifted up, as though the great clean wind of a mountain top blew through and through. God comes to most men gradually, but His impact on me was sudden and profound."
Bill never drank again! Just Love, Barefoot Bill IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6270. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Early meeting format: Paul K. on King School meetings From: Edward . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/23/2010 6:06:00 AM
who attended meetings with Dr. Bob at King School, sharing about this experience many years later from the podium -- it is available for free at: http://xa-speakers.org/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=1850 Y'all's in service, Ted G. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6271. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Early meeting format AND Bob E. (AA #11)
From: J. Lobdell . . . . . . . . . . . . 1/23/2010 1:43:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII The date of death for Bob E., given by All Addicts Anonymous as 1984, does not
agree with any primary source I can find. The passages quoted in their article
are clearly from the same recording quoted in DR BOB, a book which was begun March 1977, very shortly after Bob E. died in Akron (according to the Record of Ohio Deaths 1958-2002) on 9 February 1977 -- at which time he would still have been the longest-sober member of A.A. But after 1977 and until his own death in March 1984, Clarence S. (DLD Feb 1938)
was regarded both by himself and by others as the longest-sober member, which
suggests the accuracy of the putative 1977 deathdate for Bob E. Perhaps some member of HistoryLovers can fill us in on the 1984 death date in the AAA publication. - - - - Message 5300 says (as referred to in Message 6262 "Re: Early meeting format"): "SHORTLY BEFORE HIS DEATH IN 1984, Bob E. shared ... the following recollection of what AA was like when he first joined"
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